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谈谈外语学习中的苦事,趣事和尴尬事
Thread poster: Meixia Jordan
wherestip
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Lots of intelligent people in the U.S. Oct 16, 2013

Meixia Jordan wrote:



谢谢! Maybe this is a good snapshot of real Americans.




No, no, no. Let's just say this clip is representative of the low end on smarts.


 
Meixia Jordan
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写得太鲁莽了,谢谢更正 Oct 16, 2013

wherestip wrote:

Meixia Jordan wrote:



谢谢! Maybe this is a good snapshot of real Americans.




No, no, no. Let's just say this clip is representative of the low end on smarts.


Sorry, you are right. It is totally unfair to generalize like that, my apologies...


 
wherestip
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Low End of the Bell Curve Oct 16, 2013

Meixia Jordan wrote:

wherestip wrote:

Meixia Jordan wrote:



谢谢! Maybe this is a good snapshot of real Americans.




No, no, no. Let's just say this clip is representative of the low end on smarts.


Sorry, you are right. It is totally unfair to generalize like that, my apologies...


No need to apologize, Meixia. I just didn't want to leave it like that, 'cause it's definitely not representative of the majority of Americans.

And I agree with Yueyin, how many of us are really experts on Chinese history? Probably very, very few.


 
QHE
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心里话 Oct 16, 2013

Meixia Jordan wrote:

如果我们都能够保持一份谦虚,一份尊敬,一份宽容,就事论事,don't take it personal, 我们的中文forum 也一定能够吸引更多人参与讨论。而且许多事情是智者见智,仁者见仁,不一定有固定答案。大家各抒己见而已。

这个意思在心里(脑里?)憋了好久(已有高热症状了),就是表达不出。你说得太贴切了,danke!


 
Meixia Jordan
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多谢诸位! Oct 16, 2013

ysun wrote:

其实,许多中国人(包括我在内)对中国历史上的许多重大事件也不是很了解的。


您的确属于那儒雅谦虚类的。说实话,回想从初中高中课堂学到的历史知识,大多数细节我已经遗忘了,最关心的仍是时事,看历史传记,历史人物报道等等只是爱好。另外,在这里发言的时候,的确要先思后写,有时候写下一时的不成熟的感觉,一旦公开,则变成一种定论,容易产生误会。幸亏众多前辈都具慧眼明心,这种讨论对我益处甚大,多谢指点!

[Edited at 2013-10-16 15:00 GMT]


 
QHE
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Delight Oct 16, 2013

wherestip wrote: A thinker

Meixia Jordan wrote:

谢谢QHE的大题小作,许多见解实在是一针见血,深受启发,多谢!



Indeed. IMO, a very respectable effort at taking a stab at an all-encompassing issue. I agree with many of the observations QHE made.


Thank you, Steve. I am honored and grateful for the compliment.

I’m singing: Sunshine on my shoulders…


 
Marvin Sun
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也说一点对中国历史的心得 Oct 16, 2013

个人对历史比较感兴趣,可惜不是科班出身,纯粹只是业余爱好。

感觉在这个环境中成长起来的中国人应该对中国历史上的东西全部重新认识。出于统治和宣传目的,教科书和拍出来的电视剧跟真实的历史有可能千差万别,有的不但是错误的,而且可能与史实完全相反,有很多历史在教科书中根本没提到过。

比如根据教科书认识的宋朝岁币,认为是耻辱,实际情况可能是岁币支出对富裕的宋朝财政来说根本是小儿科,打仗要死人而且支出更多。教科书里对黄巢和李自成这些农民起义领袖都是歌颂赞扬,实际上黄巢在缺军粮的时候曾以人肉作为大军军粮,李自成在起义前也杀过债主、妻子和栽培他的领导。电视剧(《康熙王朝》)中的朱国治慷慨激昂、一身正气,实际上不但是绰号”朱白地“的大贪,而且还是屠杀汉族文人的侩子手。有一些负面的历史,比如冉闵杀胡、同治回乱等历史印象里从来没在教科书中出现过。中国古代史都成了这个样子,更遑论近现代史。







[Edited at 2013-10-16 15:22 GMT]


 
ysun
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过奖 Oct 16, 2013

Meixia,

你过奖了。我有很多缺点。

我从上初中起就偏爱数理化,对政治、历史、地理之类的课程少有兴趣。所以,我说的是实话。

此外,希望你不要过分自责,也不要多虑。Steve 和我都没有任何批评你的意思。我很高兴能在此认识你、与你讨论问题。



[Edited at 2013-10-16 17:13 GMT]


 
Meixia Jordan
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original = best Oct 16, 2013

Marvin Sun wrote:
出于统治和宣传目的,教科书和拍出来的电视剧跟真实的历史有可能千差万别,有的不但是错误的,而且可能与史实完全相反,有很多历史在教科书中根本没提到过。


原来Marvin也是历史爱好者呀。谢谢参与讨论。的确,消遣性的书籍和电视剧、艺术片中会经常改编历史事件,从而增加趣味性,吸引更多的读者观众,作者和导演需要考虑经济回报,可以理解这一出发点。然而,那些以历史事件为背景的影片,如果过于扭曲事实,也会产生许多负效应。毕竟宣传媒体也是我们接受信息的一个重要途径。就好像应该禁止儿童玩暴力电脑游戏一样,外来信息正确与否,直接影响我们的观念形成。一部不真实的历史纪录片,会严重误导观众,甚至抹杀历史。

不知为何,我忽然联想到新版电视剧《红楼梦》。《红楼梦》是我最爱的著作之一,原本我对耗资庞大的2010版电视剧充满了期望,结果从海选演员时就开始感到失望,后来,不知道是导演还是哪一位演员在饱受抨击时曾经这样回答:“至少通过我们的电视剧,现在会有更多的人去看原著了。” 的确是幸事一件!有时候真的prefer去看原著,原汁原味,不会失望。

[Edited at 2013-10-16 18:02 GMT]


 
Meixia Jordan
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being open-minded Oct 16, 2013

ysun wrote:
此外,希望你不要过分自责,也不要多虑。Steve 和我都没有任何批评你的意思。我很高兴能在此认识你、与你讨论问题。



[Edited at 2013-10-16 17:13 GMT]

谢谢!我明白您和Steve 的好意,真的也很高兴在这里结识这么多的朋友。通过您和Steve的回应,我才发现自己的发言有一叶遮目之嫌。我在许多国家工作和生活过,接触过许多截然不同的文化,所以很理解 being open-minded 的重要性。
I really appreciate our open discussion in all related issues. 这样聊天才痛快!:)


 
Meixia Jordan
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just the same Oct 16, 2013

QHE wrote:

Meixia Jordan wrote:

如果我们都能够保持一份谦虚,一份尊敬,一份宽容,就事论事,don't take it personal, 我们的中文forum 也一定能够吸引更多人参与讨论。而且许多事情是智者见智,仁者见仁,不一定有固定答案。大家各抒己见而已。

这个意思在心里(脑里?)憋了好久(已有高热症状了),就是表达不出。你说得太贴切了,danke!

都有高热症状了吗?How lucky you are! 幸亏我去北四门找到了合适的措辞!
上文也是我的心里话。参加 Proz两个月,我很喜欢这个中文平台。也很高兴能够在这里有幸结识各位。:)


 
QHE
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Need to know Oct 17, 2013

Marvin Sun wrote:

个人对历史比较感兴趣,可惜不是科班出身,纯粹只是业余爱好。

感觉在这个环境中成长起来的中国人应该对中国历史上的东西全部重新认识。出于统治和宣传目的,教科书和拍出来的电视剧跟真实的历史有可能千差万别,有的不但是错误的,而且可能与史实完全相反,有很多历史在教科书中根本没提到过。


都说离历史越远看得才越清楚,可是要多远啊? 象你提到的宋朝的事到现在好像还没看清楚。我还是看看眼前的大自然吧。

Michel Foucault has posited, in his "Society must be Defended”, that the victors of a social struggle use their political dominance to suppress a defeated adversary's version of historical events in favor of their own propaganda, which may go so far as historical revisionism. Nations adopting such an approach would likely fashion a "universal" theory of history to support their aims, with a teleological and deterministic philosophy of history used to justify the inevitableness and rightness of their victories.

      & “History is written by the victors.”____Winston Churchill


 
QHE
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Amische Oct 17, 2013

Meixia,

There is an isolated distinct group in America you may find interesting- the simple living Amish. I couldn't find a better way to blend the topic into大题小作.

There is a beautiful documentary film about the Amish at PBS site:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/films/amish/

Actually, I think the entire American Exp
... See more
Meixia,

There is an isolated distinct group in America you may find interesting- the simple living Amish. I couldn't find a better way to blend the topic into大题小作.

There is a beautiful documentary film about the Amish at PBS site:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/films/amish/

Actually, I think the entire American Experience series are outstanding; but be aware of the warning:
“If you were to sit down in front of the television tonight and decided to watch one of our films each night, it would take you nearly a YEAR to consume our entire body of work (probably longer…)”!

BTW, the amazing Amish came to my attention through a hilarious video “For Richer or Poorer”.

[Edited at 2013-10-17 16:42 GMT]
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Meixia Jordan
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interesting Oct 17, 2013

Thank you very much QHE. I could not watch the film from the link you sent due to the regional restrictions, but maybe I will find it on other websites next days. From what I just read, Amische is quite an unique community. I really wonder how they could maintain separated (largely) from the non-Amish world. Even our Great Walls did not manage to keep the outsiders out. It proves that mental walls are more solid, doesn't it? I quite like their emphasis on family relationships, but it is unbe... See more
Thank you very much QHE. I could not watch the film from the link you sent due to the regional restrictions, but maybe I will find it on other websites next days. From what I just read, Amische is quite an unique community. I really wonder how they could maintain separated (largely) from the non-Amish world. Even our Great Walls did not manage to keep the outsiders out. It proves that mental walls are more solid, doesn't it? I quite like their emphasis on family relationships, but it is unbearable if I have to forgo all the conveniences of modern technology. How I love my car, my computer and my iPhone!

..... 'The rules of the church, the Ordnung, must be observed by every member and cover most aspects of day-to-day living, including prohibitions or limitations on the use of power-line electricity, telephones, and automobiles, as well as regulations on clothing. Most Amish do not buy commercial insurance or participate in Social Security. As present-day Anabaptists, Amish church members practice nonresistance and will not perform any type of military service.'

This reminds me of my working days in Israel. Observant Jews (primarily orthodox Jews) do not operate electrical appliances directly on Shabbat. They do not turn on lights, use the telephone or fax machines, TVs or even lifts. However, some people find a way around and plug their electrical appliances into some pre-set Shabbat clocks, PRIOR to the start of the Sabbath.


[Edited at 2013-10-17 18:15 GMT]
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Meixia Jordan
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Quote Oct 17, 2013

QHE wrote:
[      & “History is written by the victors.”____Winston Churchill


Few will have the greatness to bend history itself; but each of us can work to change a small portion of events, and in the total; of all those acts will be written the history of this generation.

Robert Kennedy


 
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谈谈外语学习中的苦事,趣事和尴尬事






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